Bypassing User Account Control dialog window

Posted: 04-16-2007, 06:29 PM
User Account Control asks for permission each time I load an "unidentified
program", no matter how many times I load it. Is there a way to bypass this
message so the program loads normally? In other words, can Vista be
instructed to trust certain programs so it doesn't need to ask permission to
load them?

Thank you.

Barney

Bypassing User Account Control dialog window


Responses to "Bypassing User Account Control dialog window"

Rock
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
Re: Bypassing User Account Control dialog window
Posted: 04-16-2007, 11:27 PM
"Barney Katz" <mechanic123NOSPAM@mindspring.com> wrote
> User Account Control asks for permission each time I load an "unidentified
> program", no matter how many times I load it. Is there a way to bypass
> this message so the program loads normally? In other words, can Vista be
> instructed to trust certain programs so it doesn't need to ask permission
> to load them?
No, it can be set selectively, it's all or none. Ask yourself why does that
program need admin credentials, is there another program that can do the
same thing that doesn't, is there an update to it that removes this need.

--
Rock [MS-MVP User/Shell]

Brian Meyers
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
Re: Bypassing User Account Control dialog window
Posted: 04-17-2007, 10:46 PM
> No, it can be set selectively, it's all or none. Ask yourself why does that
> program need admin credentials, is there another program that can do the
> same thing that doesn't, is there an update to it that removes this need.
>
> --
> Rock [MS-MVP User/Shell]
>
>
This is the most annoying thing I have found while using Vista. What go does
it do? All it does is make it more time consuming to load programs. Shouldn't
it be able to comprehend that if I am installing a program that I really want
to install it? This is one feature that should be x-ed out.
Frank Saunders, MS-MVP OE/WM
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
Re: Bypassing User Account Control dialog window
Posted: 04-18-2007, 12:24 AM
"Brian Meyers" <Brian Meyers@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:60EF9DC2-50CD-4928-A912-43E53E6BEF42@microsoft.com...
>
>> No, it can be set selectively, it's all or none. Ask yourself why does
>> that
>> program need admin credentials, is there another program that can do the
>> same thing that doesn't, is there an update to it that removes this need.
>>
>> --
>> Rock [MS-MVP User/Shell]
>>
>>
> This is the most annoying thing I have found while using Vista. What go
> does
> it do? All it does is make it more time consuming to load programs.
> Shouldn't
> it be able to comprehend that if I am installing a program that I really
> want
> to install it? This is one feature that should be x-ed out.
No, it can't tell whether it's you or some malware from the net. It really
doesn't take long to get used to. I'm getting to like it.

--
Frank Saunders, MS-MVP OE/WM
http://www.fjsmjs.com
Answer in newsgroup. Don't expect an answer to email.


cerveau
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
Re: Bypassing User Account Control dialog window
Posted: 04-18-2007, 12:43 AM

Rock;275579 Wrote:
> "Barney Katz" <mechanic123NOSPAM@mindspring.com> wrote
>
>
> No, it can be set selectively, it's all or none. Ask yourself why does
> that
> program need admin credentials, is there another program that can do
> the
> same thing that doesn't, is there an update to it that removes this
> need.
>
> --
> Rock [MS-MVP User/Shell]

MS have completely missed the target with UAC and its so easy to fix.

Every time UAC prevents a program from running it should offer the
option of adding the program to a
Trusted list. You would need to enter your user id and password to get
the program added.

for example programs that the user has installed that run at start-up,
causing UAC to pop up each and
every time the pc is booted. there are literally hundreds of Trusted
programs that do this because they
aren't digitally signed and never will be

Otherwise the average user is going get so brainwashed into just
allowing every UAC pop-up that crops
up, which will completely defeat the purpose of UAC

I think MS have watched Tron to many times and thought having a MCP is
great idea.


--
cerveau
Dave Wood [MS]
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
Re: Bypassing User Account Control dialog window
Posted: 04-18-2007, 01:06 AM
No, the problem with this is that if certain administrative programs can be
launched without prompting, then a piece of malware on the system which
doesn't have admin rights could also launch these programs. And that way it
could effectively gain the ability to perform admin-only operations. To
correctly enforce separation of privileges requires the elevation prompting
every time.

I agree with Frank in that it's worth persevering with, and I personally
like the fact that I get to authorize when any program is going to run that
might change global settings on my computer. Ultimately the goal is to put
the user in control and not the malware - even if we have a way to go before
we completely get there.

Dave Wood
>
> MS have completely missed the target with UAC and its so easy to fix.
>
> Every time UAC prevents a program from running it should offer the
> option of adding the program to a
> Trusted list. You would need to enter your user id and password to get
> the program added.
>
> for example programs that the user has installed that run at start-up,
> causing UAC to pop up each and
> every time the pc is booted. there are literally hundreds of Trusted
> programs that do this because they
> aren't digitally signed and never will be
>
> Otherwise the average user is going get so brainwashed into just
> allowing every UAC pop-up that crops
> up, which will completely defeat the purpose of UAC
>
> I think MS have watched Tron to many times and thought having a MCP is
> great idea.
>
>
> --
> cerveau
Rock
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
Re: Bypassing User Account Control dialog window
Posted: 04-18-2007, 02:06 AM
"Brian Meyers" <Brian Meyers@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote
>> No, it can be set selectively, it's all or none. Ask yourself why does
>> that
>> program need admin credentials, is there another program that can do the
>> same thing that doesn't, is there an update to it that removes this need.
> This is the most annoying thing I have found while using Vista. What go
> does
> it do? All it does is make it more time consuming to load programs.
> Shouldn't
> it be able to comprehend that if I am installing a program that I really
> want
> to install it? This is one feature that should be x-ed out.
I'm sorry, but I don't see it that way. I see it as giving me control.
Each time a program runs wants admin privileges I decide if I want it to
run. I don't want some malware hooking into a pre-approved program and
doing what it wants.

Many of these programs don't really need admin privileges or could be coded
to not use it. For example several XP based programs have update utilities
that want to install themselves as a startup program through the Run key in
the registry, and asks for admin privileges. All these things do is hop
online to check if there is an update. This is absolutely silly. Firstly
there is no reason to check at startup up every time the computer is booted.
Second there is no reason it needs admin privileges. If an update is found
then it could possibly need admin privileges for the installation but that's
a different issue. Apps properly coded for Vista will not have this.

So go back to the initial questions. Why does this app have to run at
startup, why does it need admin privileges, is there an update for it or a
different, properly coded app that doesn't need admin privileges.

I want control over what runs and when. I don't want to give permission in
advance and then _assume_ every time it runs everything is just fine. Vista
doesn't care what the app does, it only cares to know your intent each time.
And that intent can't effectively be given in advance.

I have none of these apps asking for admin permissions running at startup.
The only thing that does this is msconfig if I make a change using it, and
then that can be handled at the first startup after the changes are made.
So it's not much of an imposition here.

--
Rock [MS-MVP User/Shell]

cerveau
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
Re: Bypassing User Account Control dialog window
Posted: 04-18-2007, 11:42 AM

Rock;276839 Wrote:
> "Brian Meyers" <Brian Meyers@discussions.microsoft.com> wrot
> >> No, it can be set selectively, it's all or none. Ask yourself wh
> doe
> >> tha
> >> program need admin credentials, is there another program that can d
> th
> >> same thing that doesn't, is there an update to it that removes thi
> need
>
> > This is the most annoying thing I have found while using Vista. Wha
> g
> > doe
> > it do? All it does is make it more time consuming to load programs
> > Shouldn'
> > it be able to comprehend that if I am installing a program that
> reall
> > wan
> > to install it? This is one feature that should be x-ed out
>
> I'm sorry, but I don't see it that way. I see it as giving me control
> Each time a program runs wants admin privileges I decide if I want i
> t
> run. I don't want some malware hooking into a pre-approved program an
> doing what it wants
>
> Many of these programs don't really need admin privileges or could b
> code
> to not use it. For example several XP based programs have updat
> utilitie
> that want to install themselves as a startup program through the Ru
> key i
> the registry, and asks for admin privileges. All these things do i
> ho
> online to check if there is an update. This is absolutely silly.
> Firstl
> there is no reason to check at startup up every time the computer i
> booted
> Second there is no reason it needs admin privileges. If an update i
> foun
> then it could possibly need admin privileges for the installation bu
> that'
> a different issue. Apps properly coded for Vista will not have this
>
> So go back to the initial questions. Why does this app have to run a
> startup, why does it need admin privileges, is there an update for i
> or
> different, properly coded app that doesn't need admin privileges
>
> I want control over what runs and when. I don't want to giv
> permission i
> advance and then _assume_ every time it runs everything is just fine.
> Vist
> doesn't care what the app does, it only cares to know your intent eac
> time
> And that intent can't effectively be given in advance
>
> I have none of these apps asking for admin permissions running a
> startup
> The only thing that does this is msconfig if I make a change using it
> an
> then that can be handled at the first startup after the changes ar
> made
> So it's not much of an imposition here
>
> -
> Rock [MS-MVP User/Shell
I understand your point of view, but what if a piece of malware ha
already hooked into a program?
having that program pre-approved or manually clicking the UAC pop-up t
allow it to run wont make any
difference to the malware, ie either way the user is going to click th
UAC pop up because they want to
run that program

The UAC is just adding another step into the process of Running
program, the program will still be ru
and if there is Malware present it will run also. The only differenc
is that UAC makes the user go through
an extra step each time, which when happens on every bootup, when th
user is clicking 2 or 3 UACS to
just get required programs running will make for an unpleasant vist
experience forcing the user to switch
off UAC altogether.

Admittedly though all that MS needs to do is on this problem is to wai
it out, because eventually all those
old pre-vista programs that are activating UAC will be updated o
replaced with news ones which wont
eliminating the problem all together

--
cerveau
Brent Wherry
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
RE: Bypassing User Account Control dialog window
Posted: 04-18-2007, 11:58 AM
I agree. What I would really like is to be able to authorize programs once
and have UAC acknowledge my consent.

The current design is very user unfriendly (arrogant even?)

I don't like doing it but I'm having to switch UAC off. Microsoft might
consider putting useability in front of their tedious and not very effective
security policies.

"Barney Katz" wrote:
> User Account Control asks for permission each time I load an "unidentified
> program", no matter how many times I load it. Is there a way to bypass this
> message so the program loads normally? In other words, can Vista be
> instructed to trust certain programs so it doesn't need to ask permission to
> load them?
>
> Thank you.
>
> Barney
>
Jupiter Jones [MVP]
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
Re: Bypassing User Account Control dialog window
Posted: 04-18-2007, 06:31 PM
"...but what if a piece of malware..."
Have you started the program or did the program start itself?
If the first, you know you want it.
If the second, you have something to be suspicious about.
"...either way the user is going to click..."
I don't and nobody should.
The few times I get UAC messages, I look to see what is causing it.
So far it has already been legitimate.


"...because eventually all those old pre-vista programs..."
Are you sure?
And how much time will that take?
Some programs still have not made the necessary changes to properly
run in Windows XP, and it has been over 5 years.
Intuit makes some that are a constant thorn in the side of security
conscious, particularly those in financial businesses.
Waiting it out is not a practical option if safe computing is an
issue.

"The UAC is just adding another step"
I call it "Layered security"
Malware is very sophisticated and many layers are necessary for
maximum security.

If simplicity is paramount, I can only see two solutions:
1. Power off and pack up the computer and never power on.
2. Almost as good, Clean Install and never install anything from any
source.
Use no CDs, DVDs, floppies, thumb drives etc as those are a source of
malware.

UAC was never intended to protect against everything but it goes a
step into helping the user identify what is happening and thus offer
more control.
People need to learn safe computing.

--
Jupiter Jones [MVP]
http://www3.telus.net/dandemar
http://www.dts-l.org


"cerveau" <cerveau.2p8hpf@no-mx.forums.net> wrote in message
news:cerveau.2p8hpf@no-mx.forums.net...
> I understand your point of view, but what if a piece of malware has
> already hooked into a program?
> having that program pre-approved or manually clicking the UAC pop-up
> to
> allow it to run wont make any
> difference to the malware, ie either way the user is going to click
> the
> UAC pop up because they want to
> run that program.
>
> The UAC is just adding another step into the process of Running a
> program, the program will still be run
> and if there is Malware present it will run also. The only
> difference
> is that UAC makes the user go through
> an extra step each time, which when happens on every bootup, when
> the
> user is clicking 2 or 3 UACS to
> just get required programs running will make for an unpleasant vista
> experience forcing the user to switch
> off UAC altogether.
>
> Admittedly though all that MS needs to do is on this problem is to
> wait
> it out, because eventually all those
> old pre-vista programs that are activating UAC will be updated or
> replaced with news ones which wont,
> eliminating the problem all together.
>
>
> --
> cerveau
 
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