created date & modified date puzzle

Posted: 05-27-2004, 07:17 AM
Hi,

I have Office 2001 & I'm running OS 9.1.

I created a 24 slide powerpoint file -- graphics, text, charts, tables, ...
the works. Looks great.

Since I'm a recent victim of losing data from a crash, I probably saved that
file an average of twice per slide along the way -- maybe 50 times starting
when I had started the first slide and ending after I'd perfected all 24 and
sorted the slides the way I wanted them.

If I do Get Info for that file I'm told the file was created 5/23 9:26 PM
and I'm told the file was last modified 5/23 9:27 PM.

I'm good, but I'm not good enough to make that whole slide show in one
minute!

I opened up the file and went into File, Properties...

Under the "General" tab it tells me the file was created 5/23 9:26 PM and
modified 5/23 9:27 PM

Under the "Statistics" tab it tells me the file was created 5/19 2:29 PM and
modified 5/23 9:27 PM -- almost certainly true.

Why the difference?

created date & modified date puzzle


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Responses to "created date & modified date puzzle"

David M. Marcovitz
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Re: created date & modified date puzzle
Posted: 05-27-2004, 01:07 PM
When you saved it, did you do Save As or just Save?
--David

David M. Marcovitz, Ph.D.
Director of Graduate Programs in Educational Technology
Loyola College in Maryland
Author of _Powerful PowerPoint for Educators_
http://www.loyola.edu/education/PowerfulPowerPoint/

Helene <hglymda-ns@yahoo.com> wrote in
news:BCDB0045.140E0%hglymda-ns@yahoo.com:
> Hi,
>
> I have Office 2001 & I'm running OS 9.1.
>
> I created a 24 slide powerpoint file -- graphics, text, charts,
> tables, ... the works. Looks great.
>
> Since I'm a recent victim of losing data from a crash, I probably
> saved that file an average of twice per slide along the way -- maybe
> 50 times starting when I had started the first slide and ending after
> I'd perfected all 24 and sorted the slides the way I wanted them.
>
> If I do Get Info for that file I'm told the file was created 5/23 9:26
> PM and I'm told the file was last modified 5/23 9:27 PM.
>
> I'm good, but I'm not good enough to make that whole slide show in one
> minute!
>
> I opened up the file and went into File, Properties...
>
> Under the "General" tab it tells me the file was created 5/23 9:26 PM
> and modified 5/23 9:27 PM
>
> Under the "Statistics" tab it tells me the file was created 5/19 2:29
> PM and modified 5/23 9:27 PM -- almost certainly true.
>
> Why the difference?
>
>
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Steve Rindsberg
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Re: created date & modified date puzzle
Posted: 05-27-2004, 02:06 PM
In article <BCDB0045.140E0%hglymda-ns@yahoo.com>, Helene wrote:
> Since I'm a recent victim of losing data from a crash, I probably saved that
> file an average of twice per slide along the way -- maybe 50 times starting
> when I had started the first slide and ending after I'd perfected all 24 and
> sorted the slides the way I wanted them.
>
> If I do Get Info for that file I'm told the file was created 5/23 9:26 PM
> and I'm told the file was last modified 5/23 9:27 PM.
>
> I'm good, but I'm not good enough to make that whole slide show in one
> minute!
>
> I opened up the file and went into File, Properties...
>
> Under the "General" tab it tells me the file was created 5/23 9:26 PM and
> modified 5/23 9:27 PM
>
> Under the "Statistics" tab it tells me the file was created 5/19 2:29 PM and
> modified 5/23 9:27 PM -- almost certainly true.
>
> Why the difference?
Speculation:

Do you periodically Save As rather than Save to create a succession of files?
It's a pretty good idea to do that, by the way. A crash won't take out your
whole presentation that way, just the part you've done since the last save.

Anyhow, Save As may set at least one of the Create dates to the date/time you
Saved As, since that's when the file was created in the most literal sense.

Stats, since it also tracks total editing time, may keep the original date the
presentation was first "born" (ie, created anew from a template) and never
alter it. Makes sense to have both; if that's what's going on, the interface
could make it clearer though.

--
Steve Rindsberg, PPT MVP
PPT FAQ: www.pptfaq.com
PPTools: www.pptools.com
================================================
Featured Presenter, PowerPoint Live 2004
October 10-13, San Diego, CA www.PowerPointLive.com
================================================

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Helene
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Re: created date & modified date puzzle
Posted: 05-27-2004, 02:41 PM
in article Xns94F65CE1AD163marcoNOSPAMloyolaedu@207.46.248.16 , David M.
Marcovitz at marcoNOSPAM@loyola.edu wrote on 5/27/04 8:07 AM:
> When you saved it, did you do Save As or just Save?
> --David

No, just regular Command-S save every time. Also, it occurred to me that I
did not remember to mention that the file was worked on on one computer from
start to finish (and it was saved each time to my hard disk, not removable
storage) and that I did not even move the file to another folder after the
first save.

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Helene
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Re: created date & modified date puzzle
Posted: 05-27-2004, 02:44 PM
in article VA.0000060d.1eaee25b@localhost.com, Steve Rindsberg at
abuse@localhost.com wrote on 5/27/04 9:06 AM:
> Speculation:
>
> Do you periodically Save As rather than Save to create a succession of files?
> It's a pretty good idea to do that, by the way. A crash won't take out your
> whole presentation that way, just the part you've done since the last save.
>
> Anyhow, Save As may set at least one of the Create dates to the date/time you
> Saved As, since that's when the file was created in the most literal sense.
>
> Stats, since it also tracks total editing time, may keep the original date the
> presentation was first "born" (ie, created anew from a template) and never
> alter it. Makes sense to have both; if that's what's going on, the interface
> could make it clearer though.

No, I did not do Save-As at any point during the creation of the file. I
think I'm squeamish about creating a succession of files that way after the
nightmare of using the previous version of Word which would automatically
create a succession of files until I ran out of memory. I know this version
of Office does not have that bug, and I know Save-As works differently, but
seeing a string of versions of the same file develop in a folder still makes
me nervous.


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Steve Rindsberg
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Re: created date & modified date puzzle
Posted: 05-27-2004, 07:47 PM
> No, I did not do Save-As at any point during the creation of the file. I
> think I'm squeamish about creating a succession of files that way after the
> nightmare of using the previous version of Word which would automatically
> create a succession of files until I ran out of memory.
With today's hard drives, that shouldn't be a problem; it's not as if PPT's
keeping all the past versions in memory. With Word versioning, it may have been
storing all previous versions within the same document. That'd be nasty.

You can always delete intermediate versions, but a few extra files sure beats
losing days of work to one mishap.

In any case, that still shoots down my original theory. Sounds like the answer is
"Ignore the date that's wrong, pay attention to the one that's right."

Hm. Perhaps the "wrong" one is the last save time?

--
Steve Rindsberg, PPT MVP
PPT FAQ: www.pptfaq.com
PPTools: www.pptools.com
================================================
Featured Presenter, PowerPoint Live 2004
October 10-13, San Diego, CA www.PowerPointLive.com
================================================

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Helene
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Re: created date & modified date puzzle
Posted: 05-27-2004, 09:22 PM
in article VA.00000613.1fe67984@localhost.com, Steve Rindsberg at
abuse@localhost.com wrote on 5/27/04 2:47 PM:
> With today's hard drives, that shouldn't be a problem; it's not as if PPT's
> keeping all the past versions in memory. With Word versioning, it may have
> been
> storing all previous versions within the same document. That'd be nasty.
I think what it thought it was doing is creating backup files, but what was
really happening is that as each one was saved in succession (a) the older
ones would not go away (as I think they were supposed to and (b) somehow it
made Word & my mac think ALL of the versions were open simultaneously (when
only one window was really open in Word) so I'd get to a certain point when
Word wouldn't let me save anymore until I closed some windows because I was
out of memory, but the only thing left to close was the thing I wanted to
save -- so it wasn't a hard drive storage issue, it ate up RAM.

I'm not sure I have that exactly right because I don't have that version of
Office installed anymore (it was only Word that gave me the problem,
PowerPoint & Excel worked the way they were supposed to). I've had no
similar problems since upgrading to Office 2001.
> You can always delete intermediate versions, but a few extra files sure beats
> losing days of work to one mishap.
You are right, of course. Having multiple versions of a file in progress
would be useful mostly because it would make it easier to get back something
I hastily deleted thinking it would not be needed, better than "undo" or
recreating it again.

But I didn't have a problem with that this time.
> In any case, that still shoots down my original theory. Sounds like the
> answer is
> "Ignore the date that's wrong, pay attention to the one that's right."
Now that I know I can find the "right" answer under the Statistics tab, I
know how to find it when the creation date is useful to me.

However, it would be better/easier if the actual creation date appeared in
the Get Info box so it could be seen without opening the file or if the file
could be found with Sherlock when searching by (the actual) file creation
date.
> Hm. Perhaps the "wrong" one is the last save time?
In this case it appears that the "wrong" one is one minute before the final
save time, it might be the next-to-last save time?

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Steve Rindsberg
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Re: created date & modified date puzzle
Posted: 05-28-2004, 04:29 AM
> I think what it thought it was doing is creating backup files, but what was
> really happening is that as each one was saved in succession (a) the older
> ones would not go away (as I think they were supposed to and (b) somehow it
> made Word & my mac think ALL of the versions were open simultaneously (when
> only one window was really open in Word) so I'd get to a certain point when
> Word wouldn't let me save anymore until I closed some windows because I was
> out of memory, but the only thing left to close was the thing I wanted to
> save -- so it wasn't a hard drive storage issue, it ate up RAM.
Understood. I've never heard of PPT doing that, though, so you should be save to
venture out onto the New! Improved! ice whenever you get your courage level up.
<g>
> Now that I know I can find the "right" answer under the Statistics tab, I
> know how to find it when the creation date is useful to me.
>
> However, it would be better/easier if the actual creation date appeared in
> the Get Info box so it could be seen without opening the file or if the file
> could be found with Sherlock when searching by (the actual) file creation
> date.
You might want to use the Help option to relay your suggestion to MS. That's how
they learn what's bugging us.

--
Steve Rindsberg, PPT MVP
PPT FAQ: www.pptfaq.com
PPTools: www.pptools.com
================================================
Featured Presenter, PowerPoint Live 2004
October 10-13, San Diego, CA www.PowerPointLive.com
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Helene
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Re: created date & modified date puzzle
Posted: 05-28-2004, 05:50 AM
Steve Rindsberg wrote on 5/27/04 11:29 PM:
> Understood. I've never heard of PPT doing that, though, so you should be save
> to venture out onto the New! Improved! ice whenever you get your courage level
> up.
> <g>
No, even the last version of PPT didn't do that, only the last version of
Word. I don't even have it installed on my machine anymore.


>> However, it would be better/easier if the actual creation date appeared in
>> the Get Info box so it could be seen without opening the file or if the file
>> could be found with Sherlock when searching by (the actual) file creation
>> date.
>
> You might want to use the Help option to relay your suggestion to MS. That's
> how they learn what's bugging us.
Maybe I will, though I expect the only response I'd get is "You are using
Office 2001, this mess has been fixed long ago in newer versions --
upgrade." But I'm not yet running OSX -- probably later this year when I get
a more powerful machine, I'll upgrade both the OS and Office.


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Steve Rindsberg
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Re: created date & modified date puzzle
Posted: 05-28-2004, 02:04 PM
> Maybe I will, though I expect the only response I'd get is "You are using
> Office 2001, this mess has been fixed long ago in newer versions --
> upgrade." But I'm not yet running OSX -- probably later this year when I get
> a more powerful machine, I'll upgrade both the OS and Office.
If it helps, it's more likely that you won't get any answer at all. ;-)

But 2001 was on sale until just recently, if it's not still on sale and should be
supported for some time to come.

--
Steve Rindsberg, PPT MVP
PPT FAQ: www.pptfaq.com
PPTools: www.pptools.com
================================================
Featured Presenter, PowerPoint Live 2004
October 10-13, San Diego, CA www.PowerPointLive.com
================================================

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