Did Microsoft Make a two way firewall with Vista Home Premium?

Posted: 10-11-2007, 07:38 PM
I am buying a new desktop with Vista Premium and it will have 4 gig of
Kingston Memory. My problem is that I know nothing about Vista an would like
to know if they did a better job on the firewall than in XP? I now use Norton
Internet Suite 2008 and Norton Systemworks 2008 in my laptop with XP. Can I
install both Norton products in the desktop with Vista premium and not have
any problems with Windows defender. Also the desktop has AMD Athlon 64 X2
5000. Thanks for the help an time, I just don't want to mess up my new PC.
All have a great an safe day an weekend. Does Microsoft have a web site that
will give me info on what I can add to Vista an what I should not add??

Did Microsoft Make a two way firewall with Vista Home Premium?


Responses to "Did Microsoft Make a two way firewall with Vista Home Premium?"

Carey Frisch [MVP]
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
Re: Did Microsoft Make a two way firewall with Vista Home Premium?
Posted: 10-11-2007, 07:45 PM
Norton comes with its own firewall. It will automatically
disable Vista's firewall so you should not have a problems.

--
Carey Frisch
Microsoft MVP
Windows Shell/User

---------------------------------------------------------------

"JJ" <JJ@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message news:4B8237A7-579A-4B2C-8391-1E6560B4CB25@microsoft.com...
I am buying a new desktop with Vista Premium and it will have 4 gig of
Kingston Memory. My problem is that I know nothing about Vista an would like
to know if they did a better job on the firewall than in XP? I now use Norton
Internet Suite 2008 and Norton Systemworks 2008 in my laptop with XP. Can I
install both Norton products in the desktop with Vista premium and not have
any problems with Windows defender. Also the desktop has AMD Athlon 64 X2
5000. Thanks for the help an time, I just don't want to mess up my new PC.
All have a great an safe day an weekend. Does Microsoft have a web site that
will give me info on what I can add to Vista an what I should not add??
Kayman
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
Re: Did Microsoft Make a two way firewall with Vista Home Premium?
Posted: 10-11-2007, 11:29 PM
On Thu, 11 Oct 2007 12:38:04 -0700, JJ wrote:
> I am buying a new desktop with Vista Premium and it will have 4 gig of
> Kingston Memory. My problem is that I know nothing about Vista an would like
> to know if they did a better job on the firewall than in XP?
You are not going to find anything better than the Vista FW and Vista in
itself due to the advanced features the FW and Vista are using.

http://www.microsoft.com/technet/com...uy/cg0905.mspx
http://www.microsoft.com/whdc/device/network/WFP.mspx

Jesper's Blog
http://msinfluentials.com/blogs/jesp...l-is-free.aspx
http://blogs.technet.com/jesper_joha...01/426921.aspx

http://www.microsoft.com/technet/tec...l/default.aspx
"If you try to block outbound connections from a computer that’s already
compromised, how can you be sure that the computer is really doing what you
ask? The answer: you can’t. Outbound protection is security theater—it’s a
gimmick that only gives the impression of improving your security without
doing anything that actually does improve your security. This is why
outbound protection didn’t exist in the Windows XP firewall and why it
doesn’t exist in the Windows Vista™ firewall."

Vista Firewall Control
http://sphinx-soft.com/Vista/
> I now use Norton Internet Suite 2008 and Norton Systemworks 2008 in my laptop
> with XP.
You're one of the lucky ones The retail version of Norton can play havoc
with the OS. A number of experts agree that the retail AV version of
McAfee, Norton and Trend Micro has become cumbersome and bloated for the
average user.
> Can I install both Norton products in the desktop with Vista premium
> and not have any problems with Windows defender.
You sure can.
> Also the desktop has AMD Athlon 64 X2 5000. Thanks for the help an time, I just
> don't want to mess up my new PC.
A very useful application for any new pc is the PC Decrapifier, it attempts
to remove all of the crap on your PC that you never asked for or ...
http://www.pcdecrapifier.com/
> All have a great an safe day an weekend. Does Microsoft have a web site that
> will give me info on what I can add to Vista an what I should not add??
Google is your friend; Good luck
Rob Harmer
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
Re: Did Microsoft Make a two way firewall with Vista Home Premium?
Posted: 10-12-2007, 12:02 PM
Don't forget that Vista is also sending a hell of a lot more telemetry data
out when it phones home as well!
see what else Vista is harvesting off your PC
http://news.softpedia.com/news/Forge...ft-58752.shtml

Don't forget to check out the vulnerabilities with Teredo IPv6 as well
see
http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/...oncerns-00.txt
and http://www.symantec.com/avcenter/ref...o_Security.pdf
and http://www.securiteam.com/securityre...C00O2KHFK.html and
http://www.symantec.com/enterprise/s...s_vista_n.html

Rob

"Kayman" <kayman~nospam~@operamail.com> wrote in message
news:1xy3bkn8qqgfe$.1vh7bryblj66c$.dlg@40tude.net. ..
> On Thu, 11 Oct 2007 12:38:04 -0700, JJ wrote:
>
>> I am buying a new desktop with Vista Premium and it will have 4 gig of
>> Kingston Memory. My problem is that I know nothing about Vista an would
>> like
>> to know if they did a better job on the firewall than in XP?
>
> You are not going to find anything better than the Vista FW and Vista in
> itself due to the advanced features the FW and Vista are using.
>
> http://www.microsoft.com/technet/com...uy/cg0905.mspx
> http://www.microsoft.com/whdc/device/network/WFP.mspx
>
> Jesper's Blog
> http://msinfluentials.com/blogs/jesp...l-is-free.aspx
> http://blogs.technet.com/jesper_joha...01/426921.aspx
>
> http://www.microsoft.com/technet/tec...l/default.aspx
> "If you try to block outbound connections from a computer that’s already
> compromised, how can you be sure that the computer is really doing what
> you
> ask? The answer: you can’t. Outbound protection is security theater—it’s a
> gimmick that only gives the impression of improving your security without
> doing anything that actually does improve your security. This is why
> outbound protection didn’t exist in the Windows XP firewall and why it
> doesn’t exist in the Windows Vista™ firewall."
>
> Vista Firewall Control
> http://sphinx-soft.com/Vista/
>
>> I now use Norton Internet Suite 2008 and Norton Systemworks 2008 in my
>> laptop
>> with XP.
>
> You're one of the lucky ones The retail version of Norton can play
> havoc
> with the OS. A number of experts agree that the retail AV version of
> McAfee, Norton and Trend Micro has become cumbersome and bloated for the
> average user.
>
>> Can I install both Norton products in the desktop with Vista premium
>> and not have any problems with Windows defender.
>
> You sure can.
>
>> Also the desktop has AMD Athlon 64 X2 5000. Thanks for the help an time,
>> I just
>> don't want to mess up my new PC.
>
> A very useful application for any new pc is the PC Decrapifier, it
> attempts
> to remove all of the crap on your PC that you never asked for or ...
> http://www.pcdecrapifier.com/
>
>> All have a great an safe day an weekend. Does Microsoft have a web site
>> that
>> will give me info on what I can add to Vista an what I should not add??
>
> Google is your friend; Good luck
netlink_blue
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
Re: Did Microsoft Make a two way firewall with Vista Home Premium?
Posted: 10-15-2007, 11:55 PM
Rob Harmer wrote:
> Don't forget that Vista is also sending a hell of a lot more telemetry
> data out when it phones home as well!
> see what else Vista is harvesting off your PC
> http://news.softpedia.com/news/Forge...ft-58752.shtml
>
>
> Don't forget to check out the vulnerabilities with Teredo IPv6 as well
> see
> http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/...oncerns-00.txt
> and http://www.symantec.com/avcenter/ref...o_Security.pdf
> and http://www.securiteam.com/securityre...C00O2KHFK.html and
> http://www.symantec.com/enterprise/s...s_vista_n.html
>
>
> Rob

==== IN THE NEWS ================================

Microsoft Windows Update Again in Auto-Reboot Controversy

by Paul Thurrott, thurrott@windowsitpro.com

It seems that Microsoft hasn't yet fixed a problem with Windows Update
that was causing Windows PCs all around the globe to automatically
update themselves and then reboot overnight. But this time, the
software giant isn't causing the auto-reboot behavior purposefully, it
says. Which leads us to an even more disturbing scenario: Why can't
Microsoft figure out why its own software is causing PCs to keep
rebooting?

According to a discussion thread on AeroXperience, users who had
configured Windows Update to download but not install updates recently
discovered that their machines had rebooted overnight after installing
updates automatically. Additionally, the Windows Update setting had
somehow reverted to "install automatically."

Microsoft says it has made no changes to Windows Update or Automatic
Updates that would cause this behavior. "We have been hearing some
questions recently regarding Tuesday's update release changing
automatic updating settings," Microsoft Update program manager Nate
Clinton wrote recently in one of the company's blogs. "We are still
looking into this to see if another application is making this change
during setup with user consent, or if this issue is related to
something else. We are continuing the investigation."

Last month, Microsoft found itself embroiled in controversy after it
was discovered that the company had silently updated the Windows
Update components in various Windows versions without alerting
customers. The software giant has since changed the way it delivers
such updates, making this week's events all the more disturbing. But
Microsoft seems to believe that components outside of Windows Update
are making the changes this time. In other words, this isn't some
insidious plot, at least not from those responsible for Windows
Update.

AeroXperience - Automatic Update feature forces machines across the
globe to reboot:
http://list.windowsitpro.com/t?ctl=6...F8D06F24CFFB06

http://list.windowsitpro.com/t?ctl=6...F8D06F24CFFB06

========

Those Teredo tweaks must be complex to code. Nips!

Netlink

NetLink_Blue
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
Re: Did Microsoft Make a two way firewall with Vista Home Premium?
Posted: 10-14-2007, 02:42 PM

"Kayman" <kayman~nospam~@operamail.com> wrote in message
news:1xy3bkn8qqgfe$.1vh7bryblj66c$.dlg@40tude.net. ..
> http://www.microsoft.com/technet/tec...l/default.aspx
> "If you try to block outbound connections from a computer that’s already
> compromised, how can you be sure that the computer is really doing what
> you
> ask? The answer: you can’t.
LOL - what beautiful Homer Simpson logic! Umm ... doughnuts.

Building and enabling a 2-way firewall as part of Windows would make a
support-hairball for Microsoft the likes of which hasn't been seen on Earth
yet.

Windows Geniune Advantage would be exposed - nekked to the world,
continually asking to phone-home. Folks would realize that everytime they
do a file search on their computers, Microsoft is listening in. The exposed
collection of "helpful" Windows OS calls to Redmond would make a lot of
folks start acting like Steve Ballmer. Now THAT is scarey. :~P

> Outbound protection is security theater—it’s a
> gimmick that only gives the impression of improving your security without
> doing anything that actually does improve your security. This is why
> outbound protection didn’t exist in the Windows XP firewall and why it
> doesn’t exist in the Windows Vista™ firewall."
Someone, please SLAP Homer Simpson for the above baloney. Thanks.

netlink

Straight Talk
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
Re: Did Microsoft Make a two way firewall with Vista Home Premium?
Posted: 10-14-2007, 03:14 PM
On Sun, 14 Oct 2007 07:42:31 -0700, "NetLink_Blue"
<PcjTv@cooltoad.com> wrote:
>Building and enabling a 2-way firewall as part of Windows would make a
>support-hairball for Microsoft the likes of which hasn't been seen on Earth
>yet.
Maybe. But not for the reasons you assume.
>Windows Geniune Advantage would be exposed - nekked to the world,
>continually asking to phone-home. Folks would realize that everytime they
>do a file search on their computers, Microsoft is listening in. The exposed
>collection of "helpful" Windows OS calls to Redmond would make a lot of
>folks start acting like Steve Ballmer. Now THAT is scarey. :~P
Not at all. See, MS is in charge of the OS kernel. If they want to
phone home without ANY software firewall noticing it, they can just do
so.

If you don't trust MS you have no choice but to not run windows. It's
that simple.
>> Outbound protection is security theaterits a
>> gimmick that only gives the impression of improving your security without
>> doing anything that actually does improve your security. This is why
>> outbound protection didnt exist in the Windows XP firewall and why it
>> doesnt exist in the Windows Vista firewall."
>
>Someone, please SLAP Homer Simpson for the above baloney. Thanks.
Someone please educate yourself about the windows platform design to
understand why outbound protection *is* security theater.
NetLink_Blue
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
Re: Did Microsoft Make a two way firewall with Vista Home Premium?
Posted: 10-14-2007, 04:10 PM

"Straight Talk" <b__nice@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:m3c4h3tcjbdncmjartabla33i7d5aqo48n@4ax.com...
> On Sun, 14 Oct 2007 07:42:31 -0700, "NetLink_Blue"
> <PcjTv@cooltoad.com> wrote:
>
>>Building and enabling a 2-way firewall as part of Windows would make a
>>support-hairball for Microsoft the likes of which hasn't been seen on
>>Earth
>>yet.
>
> Maybe. But not for the reasons you assume.
I'm listening, Straight Talk. Give me some of your reasons.

>>Windows Geniune Advantage would be exposed - nekked to the world,
>>continually asking to phone-home. Folks would realize that everytime they
>>do a file search on their computers, Microsoft is listening in. The
>>exposed
>>collection of "helpful" Windows OS calls to Redmond would make a lot of
>>folks start acting like Steve Ballmer. Now THAT is scarey. :~P
>
> Not at all. See, MS is in charge of the OS kernel. If they want to
> phone home without ANY software firewall noticing it, they can just do
> so.
Are you confirming that MS is doing this? Maybe that recent "stealth"
update on Windows OS update files themselves?

> If you don't trust MS you have no choice but to not run windows. It's
> that simple.
More bee-autiful Homer Simpson logic. What OS would you recommend, Homer?
How about MS customers continueing keeping an eye on MS, and being careful.
That's not an option for you? Fine. It's an option for me, Straight Talk.


netlink

Straight Talk
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
Re: Did Microsoft Make a two way firewall with Vista Home Premium?
Posted: 10-15-2007, 05:38 AM
On Sun, 14 Oct 2007 09:10:11 -0700, "NetLink_Blue"
<PcjTv@cooltoad.com> wrote:
>
>"Straight Talk" <b__nice@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>news:m3c4h3tcjbdncmjartabla33i7d5aqo48n@4ax.com.. .
>> On Sun, 14 Oct 2007 07:42:31 -0700, "NetLink_Blue"
>> <PcjTv@cooltoad.com> wrote:
>>
>>>Building and enabling a 2-way firewall as part of Windows would make a
>>>support-hairball for Microsoft the likes of which hasn't been seen on
>>>Earth
>>>yet.
>>
>> Maybe. But not for the reasons you assume.
>
>I'm listening, Straight Talk. Give me some of your reasons.
>
>
>>>Windows Geniune Advantage would be exposed - nekked to the world,
>>>continually asking to phone-home. Folks would realize that everytime they
>>>do a file search on their computers, Microsoft is listening in. The
>>>exposed
>>>collection of "helpful" Windows OS calls to Redmond would make a lot of
>>>folks start acting like Steve Ballmer. Now THAT is scarey. :~P
>>
>> Not at all. See, MS is in charge of the OS kernel. If they want to
>> phone home without ANY software firewall noticing it, they can just do
>> so.
>
>Are you confirming that MS is doing this?
No. I'm saying they can easily do so if they want to. Also without any
personal firewall illusionware noticing it.
>Maybe that recent "stealth" update on Windows OS update files themselves?
>
>
>> If you don't trust MS you have no choice but to not run windows. It's
>> that simple.
>
>More bee-autiful Homer Simpson logic.
Get out of your cartoon world and into the real one.
>What OS would you recommend, Homer?
I'm not Homer.
>How about MS customers continueing keeping an eye on MS, and being careful.
>That's not an option for you? Fine. It's an option for me, Straight Talk.
I'm not the one complaining here, am I? I have no problem using MS
products. Thing is, your idea of being in control is flawed.
netlink_blue
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
Re: Did Microsoft Make a two way firewall with Vista Home Premium?
Posted: 10-18-2007, 05:03 PM
Straight Talk wrote:
> On Sun, 14 Oct 2007 07:42:31 -0700, "NetLink_Blue"
> <PcjTv@cooltoad.com> wrote:
>>>Outbound protection is security theaterits a
>>>gimmick that only gives the impression of improving your security without
>>>doing anything that actually does improve your security. This is why
>>>outbound protection didnt exist in the Windows XP firewall and why it
>>>doesnt exist in the Windows Vista firewall."
>>
>>Someone, please SLAP Homer Simpson for the above baloney. Thanks.
>
>
> Someone please educate yourself about the windows platform design to
> understand why outbound protection *is* security theater.

I have started to educate myself about "the windows platform design"
re: outbound protection.

Windows OS leaks like a sieve. There is no firewall that can contain
all the "known" exploits that exist.

Microsoft themselves can not build a firewall with reasonably secure
outbound protection without "breaking" most/too-many Windows capablities
& convenience features.

When drama-queen Straight Talk mocks outbound firewall protection, he
has a point (but his hair covers it up). In my eyes, ST is really
mocking Windows OS. Firewalls don't really "leak" - it's Windows that
leaks! Software firewalls get carried along for the ride on Windows OS
code. And there is really no practical way on God's green earth to stop
Windows from leaking, unless you keep yourself disconnected from the
Internet.

The real STAR of outbound "Security-Theater" is Windows.

Do firewall companies play-up and overstate their capablities? I
believe they do. (shock, gasp, dismay)

Not all adware or malware goes to all 15 or so extremes of exploits ...

http://www.firewallleaktester.com/index.html

I have lived behind a router for many years now. I shutter at the
thought of directly hooking up to the 'Net. The firewalls I have run
with outbound filters have served me with a modicum of convenience and
alerts. But, who knows ...

the Shadow knows,
NetLnk

Get a router. Use Vista's firewall (or XP SP-2's) to at least cloak all
your open ports if directily connected.
 
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