Migrating Raid 0 across installs

Posted: 08-09-2008, 08:07 AM

Here's what happened: I had a PC set up with a Raid 0 in vista that wa
not the boot drive. I was using the Raid 0 array for video storage an
high speed large file access. I have all the files backed up, n
worries there, I wanted the speed and didn't care about data redundancy
I would rather games load faster and movies transcode and edit snappie
rather than lose files which I can easily re-install and such. Anyways
the Raid 0 array was set up in Vista x64 business edition as a secondar
array, not the boot drive array. I now have a new system and would lik
to simply pluck out the two drives and transplant them into the new P
and set the array back up in vista x64 business as a secondary rai
array again, but would like to not have to hassle with re-installing an
copying a terabyte of data back onto the array. Is there any way t
simply tell vista that the two drives it sees are in a raid 0 array
tell it the settings they were at, and have it simply recognize them a
a single unit and function as a raid 0 without having to reformat them?
I'm somewhat confused at how to go about this using vista's dis
management utility

--
Lekk
Posted via http://www.vistaheads.co

Migrating Raid 0 across installs


Responses to "Migrating Raid 0 across installs"

Kerry Brown
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Posts: n/a
 
Re: Migrating Raid 0 across installs
Posted: 08-09-2008, 02:31 PM
This is probably not possible. If it is possible you would have to consult
the manual for the RAID controller in the new system for how to import an
existing array. Even if this possibility exists it probably still won't work
unless the RAID controllers from both systems are the same.

--
Kerry Brown
MS-MVP - Windows Desktop Experience: Systems Administration
http://www.vistahelp.ca/phpBB2/
http://vistahelpca.blogspot.com/




"Lekko" <Lekko.3dva02@no-mx.forums.vistaheads.com> wrote in message
news:Lekko.3dva02@no-mx.forums.vistaheads.com...
>
> Here's what happened: I had a PC set up with a Raid 0 in vista that was
> not the boot drive. I was using the Raid 0 array for video storage and
> high speed large file access. I have all the files backed up, no
> worries there, I wanted the speed and didn't care about data redundancy.
> I would rather games load faster and movies transcode and edit snappier
> rather than lose files which I can easily re-install and such. Anyways,
> the Raid 0 array was set up in Vista x64 business edition as a secondary
> array, not the boot drive array. I now have a new system and would like
> to simply pluck out the two drives and transplant them into the new PC
> and set the array back up in vista x64 business as a secondary raid
> array again, but would like to not have to hassle with re-installing and
> copying a terabyte of data back onto the array. Is there any way to
> simply tell vista that the two drives it sees are in a raid 0 array,
> tell it the settings they were at, and have it simply recognize them as
> a single unit and function as a raid 0 without having to reformat them?
> I'm somewhat confused at how to go about this using vista's disk
> management utility.
>
>
> --
> Lekko
> Posted via http://www.vistaheads.com
>
Lekko
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
Re: Migrating Raid 0 across installs
Posted: 08-09-2008, 09:42 PM

Well, I would agree with you except it isn't a hardware raid, it is
software raid managed by Vista. Since it is a software raid.... i
should, in theory, be able to be rebuilt and function the sam
regardless of controllers and drivers. One would think.. The onl
thing is Vista's disk management won't allow you to set up a raid o
drives that are not reformatted. I was hoping to simply restore th
raid without having to reformat. Perhaps there is an other way.

--
Lekk
Posted via http://www.vistaheads.co

Kerry Brown
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
Re: Migrating Raid 0 across installs
Posted: 08-10-2008, 02:00 AM
I highly recommend you don't use software RAID and in particular software
RAID 0. You will lose data because of it eventually. The overhead of
software RAID will be more than any speed increase in any case.

--
Kerry Brown
MS-MVP - Windows Desktop Experience: Systems Administration
http://www.vistahelp.ca/phpBB2/
http://vistahelpca.blogspot.com/


"Lekko" <Lekko.3dwcw7@no-mx.forums.vistaheads.com> wrote in message
news:Lekko.3dwcw7@no-mx.forums.vistaheads.com...
>
> Well, I would agree with you except it isn't a hardware raid, it is a
> software raid managed by Vista. Since it is a software raid.... it
> should, in theory, be able to be rebuilt and function the same
> regardless of controllers and drivers. One would think.. The only
> thing is Vista's disk management won't allow you to set up a raid on
> drives that are not reformatted. I was hoping to simply restore the
> raid without having to reformat. Perhaps there is an other way..
>
>
> --
> Lekko
> Posted via http://www.vistaheads.com
>
Lekko
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
Re: Migrating Raid 0 across installs
Posted: 08-10-2008, 06:01 AM

While we can sit here all day discussing optimal and ideal situations
the RAID controller I was using wouldn't allow multiple Raid 0 array
simultaneously, hence why I had to have the backup raid and output b
software controlled. While I understand that software solutions ar
slower with overhead and are issue-prone, the alternative would hav
been a single-drive solution, and none of them had the throughpu
necessary to deal with the throughputs I needed. besides, I was using
quad core that wasn't seeing 100% load across all four cores, so on
core always had resources to cover it. Anyways.. I'm going to end u
using R-studio to virtualize the raid and pull the data off the ol
array onto a new set of drives (single drives now (was 2x320 now goin
to 1x750), might set up in a raid 5 once I can afford a good controller
budget permitting.) Thanks... for the criticism and no actual help

--
Lekk
Posted via http://www.vistaheads.co

Kerry Brown
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
Re: Migrating Raid 0 across installs
Posted: 08-10-2008, 03:12 PM
Sorry you took it that way. I honestly feel that the best help in this
situation is to recommend you use a different RAID solution. This is a peer
to peer support group. All you will find here is opinions. I gave you mine
:-)

I have seen too many cases of lost data due to both RAID 0 and software
RAID. Combining the two is not something I would contemplate in any
scenario. If you need that kind of throughput then I recommend SCSI or SAS
drives with an appropriate controller.

--
Kerry Brown
MS-MVP - Windows Desktop Experience: Systems Administration
http://www.vistahelp.ca/phpBB2/
http://vistahelpca.blogspot.com/


"Lekko" <Lekko.3dwz42@no-mx.forums.vistaheads.com> wrote in message
news:Lekko.3dwz42@no-mx.forums.vistaheads.com...
>
> While we can sit here all day discussing optimal and ideal situations,
> the RAID controller I was using wouldn't allow multiple Raid 0 arrays
> simultaneously, hence why I had to have the backup raid and output be
> software controlled. While I understand that software solutions are
> slower with overhead and are issue-prone, the alternative would have
> been a single-drive solution, and none of them had the throughput
> necessary to deal with the throughputs I needed. besides, I was using a
> quad core that wasn't seeing 100% load across all four cores, so one
> core always had resources to cover it. Anyways.. I'm going to end up
> using R-studio to virtualize the raid and pull the data off the old
> array onto a new set of drives (single drives now (was 2x320 now going
> to 1x750), might set up in a raid 5 once I can afford a good controller,
> budget permitting.) Thanks... for the criticism and no actual help.
>
>
> --
> Lekko
> Posted via http://www.vistaheads.com
>
DL
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
Re: Migrating Raid 0 across installs
Posted: 08-10-2008, 11:37 PM
Software raid is a bottleneck and IMO counter productive
If your mobo doesn't support the raid solution you require use a raid card,
decent raid cards retail from $300 upwards
I know not a solution to your request, but something to be born in mind for
the future.

"Lekko" <Lekko.3dwz42@no-mx.forums.vistaheads.com> wrote in message
news:Lekko.3dwz42@no-mx.forums.vistaheads.com...
>
> While we can sit here all day discussing optimal and ideal situations,
> the RAID controller I was using wouldn't allow multiple Raid 0 arrays
> simultaneously, hence why I had to have the backup raid and output be
> software controlled. While I understand that software solutions are
> slower with overhead and are issue-prone, the alternative would have
> been a single-drive solution, and none of them had the throughput
> necessary to deal with the throughputs I needed. besides, I was using a
> quad core that wasn't seeing 100% load across all four cores, so one
> core always had resources to cover it. Anyways.. I'm going to end up
> using R-studio to virtualize the raid and pull the data off the old
> array onto a new set of drives (single drives now (was 2x320 now going
> to 1x750), might set up in a raid 5 once I can afford a good controller,
> budget permitting.) Thanks... for the criticism and no actual help.
>
>
> --
> Lekko
> Posted via http://www.vistaheads.com
>

DevilsPGD
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
Re: Migrating Raid 0 across installs
Posted: 08-11-2008, 01:04 AM
In message <u4nCTI0#IHA.3928@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl> "DL"
<address@invalid> wrote:
>Software raid is a bottleneck and IMO counter productive
>If your mobo doesn't support the raid solution you require use a raid card,
>decent raid cards retail from $300 upwards
This really depends on your needs. RAID-1 and RAID-5 are definitely far
slower, although if redundancy is more important then performance, the
penalty might be worth it (although I can't imagine any case where
RAID-1 would be the way to go, unless you only wanted two physical
disks)

RAID-0 however, is a different ballpark. As long as your controller can
keep up, it really shouldn't matter if the striping is being done by
software or hardware.
Kerry Brown
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
Re: Migrating Raid 0 across installs
Posted: 08-11-2008, 03:39 AM
Calculating the stripes and then queuing the writes can takes some CPU time.
Add in the fact that the SATA controller itself also takes some CPU time and
software RAID 0 loses a lot of the supposed performance gains. A proper RAID
controller has it's own CPU and does bus mastering so the CPU is free to do
other things. The OP mentioned he wanted performance for movie editing and
movie transcoding. These are both CPU intensive in and of themselves. Using
the CPU for RAID 0 at the same time may actually slow the overall process
down even if the actual disk read/writes are marginally faster.
--
Kerry Brown
MS-MVP - Windows Desktop Experience: Systems Administration
http://www.vistahelp.ca/phpBB2/
http://vistahelpca.blogspot.com/


"DevilsPGD" <spam_narf_spam@crazyhat.net> wrote in message
news:e83v9459tqaq5g98k6auusmrdmoegq2ejs@4ax.com...
> In message <u4nCTI0#IHA.3928@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl> "DL"
> <address@invalid> wrote:
>
>>Software raid is a bottleneck and IMO counter productive
>>If your mobo doesn't support the raid solution you require use a raid
>>card,
>>decent raid cards retail from $300 upwards
>
> This really depends on your needs. RAID-1 and RAID-5 are definitely far
> slower, although if redundancy is more important then performance, the
> penalty might be worth it (although I can't imagine any case where
> RAID-1 would be the way to go, unless you only wanted two physical
> disks)
>
> RAID-0 however, is a different ballpark. As long as your controller can
> keep up, it really shouldn't matter if the striping is being done by
> software or hardware.
DevilsPGD
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
Re: Migrating Raid 0 across installs
Posted: 08-11-2008, 12:55 PM
In message <ObhopP2#IHA.2060@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl> "Kerry Brown"
<kerry@kdbNOSPAMsys-tems.c*a*m> wrote:
>Calculating the stripes and then queuing the writes can takes some CPU time.
>Add in the fact that the SATA controller itself also takes some CPU time and
>software RAID 0 loses a lot of the supposed performance gains. A proper RAID
>controller has it's own CPU and does bus mastering so the CPU is free to do
>other things. The OP mentioned he wanted performance for movie editing and
>movie transcoding. These are both CPU intensive in and of themselves. Using
>the CPU for RAID 0 at the same time may actually slow the overall process
>down even if the actual disk read/writes are marginally faster.
Indeed -- Hardware RAID-0 is generally better then software RAID-0, as
long as you have a halfway decent controller.

Unfortunately, some of the lower end RAID-0 controllers perform far
worse then software RAID-0 on a better drive controller, and most modern
motherboards have reasonably decent onboard drive controllers these days
(at least sufficient to outperform the underlying drives)

I'm also not seeing any bus mastering improvements due to RAID here as
long as the underlying drive controller is bus mastering capable. Am I
missing something?
 
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