Re: Vista Install destroys boot sector? - "drives.png" (1/1) uuEncoded 50257 bytes

Hi, Daron.

Sorry for the delay. I've been suffering hard drive trauma. My Maxtor SATA
120 GB #2 HD refused to boot last week. After much unsuccessful fumbling
around, I ran Maxtor's PowerMax and it said the drive is bad, RMA it. And
PowerMax says my Maxtor SATA 200 GB #3 HD is failing, too! So I'm expecting
replacements for both of them Real Soon Now. Until then, I'm up and
running, but on crutches.

Inline...

"Tekguru (Daron Brewood)" <tekguru@tekguru.co.uk> wrote in message
news:15sxen8px1c1x$.dlg@tekguru.co.uk...

> On Mon, 20 Feb 2006 16:10:31 -0600, R. C. White wrote:
>

>> When Vista is installed, it does not "destroy" the boot sector, exactly.
>> But it can't boot Vista without the proper codes in the boot sector, so
>> it
>> overwrites that sector with its own codes. This doesn't destroy the boot
>> sector, but it does overwrite whatever is there (the WinXP codes). Then
>> Vista Setup also copies the other files that it needs into the System
>> Partition and Boot Volume. Vista's BCD (Boot Configuration Data) system
>> offers to boot a "Legacy" operating system if it finds WinXP or other
>> older
>> OS already there. When we select Legacy from the boot menu, Vista moves
>> its
>> BCD out of the way, loads the boot sector code that WinXP needs, then
>> turns
>> control over to that code, which loads NTLDR, NTDETECT.COM and Boot.ini.
>> From that point on, WinXP doesn't even know that Vista exists (except for
>> all those files on your hard drive).

>
> RC cheers for that data, sound like you know what you are talking about.

Thanks for the vote of confidence, but I don't ALWAYS get it right. :^{

> I'm wondering if you could outline the steps needed to get Vista installed
> as a dual bot system with XP/MCE.

Easy. Two ways. Either boot from the Vista DVD and tell it where you want
it to install. Or boot into WinXP, then run Setup from the Vista DVD from
inside WinXP. In either case, Vista Setup will install Vista and, in the
process, create its needed startup files and boot sector on your System
Partition (typically C:, but not always - read on). If you boot from the
DVD to install Vista, Setup will decide for itself which "drive" letters to
assign to which partitions and logical drives. If you run Vista Setup from
within WinXP, it will respect your drive letter assignments, so far as
possible. Since I learned this secret a couple of builds ago, I much prefer
installing from within WinXP so that I can control the drive letters. I
first use Disk Management in WinXP to create and format the volume I want to
use for Vista and assign it a drive letter; then I insert the Vista DVD and
follow the prompts, being careful to point it to the right volume, looking
at both the drive letter and the HD/partition selection.

> At the moment I have a SATA/IDE system where the SATA acts as the C: boot
> drive (split into three partitions)

Bad terminology...and it's not just semantics because it can cause confusion
with any further attempts to understand (or explain) the way things work.

(Hmm... As I composed the rest of this and referred to your screenshots, I
realized that you already know most of what follows. But since I already
typed it, I'll leave it in, just for a review - and to clarify the
terminology I'm using.)

A letter such as C: does not apply to an entire physical hard drive. It is
assigned to a single VOLUME, which can be either a primary partition or a
logical drive in an extended partition. (The extended partition itself does
not get a letter, so we can't say that letters are assigned to
"partitions".) Typically, WinXP's rules assign C: to the first primary
partition on the HD designated in the BIOS as the boot device. But the C:
"drive" cannot be further "split into three partitions".

And "drive" letters are not permanent. What is C: when you boot into WinXP
might be D: or X: when you boot into Vista - or even into a second
installation of WinXP on the same computer. Drive letters assignments are
in the Registry, but WinXP can't read Vista's Registry - or vice versa.

I think what you mean is that your SATA HD is set (in the computer's BIOS)
as the boot device. The Active (bootable) primary partition on this HD is
C:, and there is a second primary partition, currently F: in WinXP.

If you change your BIOS to boot from one of your IDE HDs, your drive letters
may change. If you boot from the DVD to install Vista, Setup will have no
idea what letters you've already assigned and will start from scratch and
assign its own. My understanding is that Build 5308 handles this
differently than 5270, but I can't check it because of my own HD problem.

> with the IDE and rest of the SATA drive
> used to store data / and installed apps.
>
> The drives are configured as:
>
> IDE Disk 0 - E: 19.13Gb (Media Center recording)
> IDE Disk 1 - D: 27.83Gb (Apps), G: 27.83Gb, (Work Drive), H: 18.89 (Shared
> Files)
> SATA Disk 2 - C: 39.06 (Boot / Windows), F: 150.86Gb (Media Center
> recording & Sky Broadband Movies)
>
> There are other drives, but these are either removable storage or my iPod.
>
> (See screnshot attached).

Thanks for that info. It makes your situation very clear. My system is
similar, with one IDE and 2 SATA, plus other devices.

> I'm looking for recommendations on which drive / partition to load Vista
> on
> and a 'safe' procedure on how to install a dual boot system without
> messing
> up Media Center. Hopefully with dual boot options which will allow me to
> boot into either system.
>
> Hope you can help!

You can install Vista on any of the volumes shown in the screen shot EXCEPT
G: (not enough space left), or on the removable Disk 3, or, apparently, C:.
Disk Management shows C: as the System partition, and it does not show any
volume as (Boot). As the Help file says, only one "status" will be shown,
even if more than one applies, and that apparently is the case here because
C: is both the System Partition for the whole computer and the Boot Volume
for WinXP. This is another spot where terminology comes into play, and it
is counterintuitive: We BOOT from the SYSTEM partition and keep the
operating SYSTEM files in the BOOT volume. The System Partition must be a
primary partition, and there is only one, no matter how many different
operating systems are installed. But there is (or at least there SHOULD be)
a separate boot volume for each operating system, and any primary partition
or logical drive on any fixed HD in your computer can be a boot volume.
Now, apparently, C:\Windows is the "boot folder" for WinXP/MCE. If you
install Vista from WinXP into F: (for example, since it has the most free
space), Setup will create a new F:\Windows folder, which will be the boot
folder for Vista, and F: will then be the Boot volume for Vista. When you
are booted into Vista, Disk Management will show the (Boot) status for F:,
but when you are booted into WinXP, F: will be "just another volume" so far
as WinXP is concerned. Both Vista and WinXP should show C: as (System).
(Build 5308 is the first onne that lets Disk Management display multiple
Status labels for a volume.)

As my earlier message said, Vista Setup will automatically detect that WinXP
is already installed. It will overwrite the boot sector and install Vista's
new startup files, saving your existing WinXP startup files as the "Legacy"
boot-up system. On each reboot, you should see a menu that offers to boot
either Vista (although it doesn't SAY Vista) or your Legacy system. Choose
Legacy and your WinXP should boot normally. If you make Legacy the default
and give yourself a few seconds to choose Vista, then you should see almost
no delay in booting into WinXP and almost no difference from what you are
seeing today in the way WinXP boots and runs.

> Cheers in advance!
>
>
> --
> Tekguru (Daron Brewood)
> MS-MVP/Mobile Devices

I hope the Cheers apply. ;^} Please post back and let us know how it works
out for you.

RC
--
R. C. White, CPA [RC]
San Marcos, TX
rc@grandecom.net
Microsoft Windows MVP